Ex-Hegseth adviser details "tale of two Petes," as Trump stands by Defense Sec
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Colin Carroll described his former boss Pete Hegseth as "agitated" during meetings. Photo by Anna Moneymaker/Getty Images
Colin Carroll, a former adviser to Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth offered new details Monday about his former boss during an interview, depicting Hegseth as both paranoid and obsessed with his public image.
The big picture: Carroll's appearance on "The Megyn Kelly Show" comes as Hegseth is facing calls for his ousting by members of Congress and former Pentagon spokesperson John Ullyot went public with his expectation that President Trump will soon fire his embattled Cabinet member.
- The firings of Carroll, Dan Caldwell, a senior adviser, and Darin Selnick, the Pentagon's deputy chief of staff, followed by Ullyot's resignation, have put the Department of Defense in additional turmoil at a time when the department was already reeling over Hegseth's use of Signal.
What they're saying: Speaking on Kelly's podcast, Carroll portrayed his former boss as obsessed, agitated, frequently aggressive and preoccupied with media leaks in the aftermath of the Signal chat leak.
- "I think it kind of consumed the team a little bit," Carroll said. "If you look at a pie chart of the secretary's day, at this point, 50 percent of it is probably a leak investigation."
- He also said Hegseth will film his morning workouts with members of the military, in part to dismantle the image painted of him prior to his confirmation hearing — that he is undisciplined and an excessive drinker.
- When asked by Kelly if he thought Hegseth "is okay," Carrol said, "I honestly — I don't know. I'm not sure."
Carroll also described Hegseth as a Defense secretary who veers between extremes: talented and temperamental.
- He referenced one meeting in particular between Hegseth and the Republican House Freedom Caucus.
- "There is not a secretary in living memory that could have done as good a job with those guys," Carroll said. "He was super direct, he was very transparent and they left. At the same time I've seen the secretary in more internal meetings where he is super focused on like very, in my opinion, weird details and very agitated and kind of like yelling and just nothing's good. So it's like 'a tale of two Petes.'"
The other side: In an interview with The Atlantic published on Monday, Trump offered a vote of support for Hegseth.
- "He's gonna get it together," Trump said. "I had a talk with him, a positive talk, but I had a talk with him."
- "Secretary Hegseth has delivered more change to the DoD in 100 days that most Secretaries have in four years," Chief Pentagon Spokesman Sean Parnell said in a statement to Axios before listing several of Hegseth's accomplishments, including "eradication of DEI from the military, and nearly 6 billion dollars in savings for the Pentagon."
- "While the fake news media – who ignored the chaos created by the previous administration – focuses on gossip, we're focused on RESULTS," the statement said.
Catch up quick: Amid the Signalgate investigation, the fired staffers have engaged a media brawl with Hegseth.
- Carroll, Caldwell and Selnick released a joint statement shortly after their dismissals saying that unnamed officials from the department had "slandered our character with baseless attacks"
- They added, "At this time, we still have not been told what exactly we were investigated for, if there is still an active investigation, or if there was even a real investigation of 'leaks' to begin with."
- Ullyot wrote in a Politico opinion piece earlier this month that "the last month has been a full-blown meltdown at the Pentagon."
- Hegseth lashed out at members of the media and "anonymous smears from disgruntled former employees" while talking to reporters at the White House's Easter Egg Roll.
Editor's note: This story has been updated with comment from the Pentagon.
