Scoop: Mike Johnson’s tense text messages with Liz Cheney
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DETROIT, Mich. — Speaker Mike Johnson (R-La.) and former Rep. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.) engaged in a tense text exchange last week, Axios has learned.
Why it matters: Johnson told Axios in an exclusive interview on Saturday that he reached out to Cheney — a former close ally and friend — after she took aim at him on NBC's "Meet the Press" over certifying the election.
- Johnson said the two "agreed to disagree" over whether Trump is a threat to democracy.
- Cheney disputed Johnson's characterization of the exchange, telling Axios that she and the speaker "used to be friends, but we did not 'agree to disagree.'"
Zoom in: Johnson said he had not spoken to Cheney in a "very long time," but decided to text her after "she said some very uncharitable things."
- "I do not have faith that Mike Johnson will fulfill his constitutional obligations," Cheney told NBC on Oct. 13.
- Johnson told Axios he shared "how disappointed I was in that, to make things personal, because I've not done that. ... We had a little debate in conversation, on text message, back and forth and agreed to disagree."
Cheney stood by her accusations against Johnson, taking issue with his comments that he will commit to certifying if "the election is free and fair and legal."
- Cheney was vice chair of the House Select Committee on Jan. 6, and is now serving a surrogate for Vice President Kamala Harris.
- In a statement on Sunday, Cheney doubled down on her criticisms of Johnson: "Mike knows this is a conscious choice between right and wrong and can't honestly rationalize supporting Trump on this."
The intrigue: Cheney has repeatedly hit Johnson for his role in spearheading an amicus brief in 2020 that supported challenging the election results in four swing states.
But Johnson argued that her accusations that he won't carry out his constitutional duty are "dishonest."
- "You know the idea that President Trump is somehow a danger to the Republic, and that any of us who support him are a danger or would not fulfill our constitutional obligations, all these things that have been said are it's just nonsense," Johnson told Axios in an interview.
- "She knows, she knows me. She used to know me well and knows that I'm a constitutional conservative, and I take all matters at this level very seriously, and I will fulfill my constitutional oath. And to say otherwise is just dishonest," he continued.
The bottom line: Cheney told Axios she has repeatedly told Johnson "there was never any good faith basis for the stolen election allegations," and alleged "Mike knows Trump is dangerously unstable."
- "Had Mike been acting as a lawyer representing Trump, he would have been sanctioned, disbarred or indicted for taking those positions — just as several Trump lawyers were. The courts, including several conservative judges appointed by Trump, rejected each legal argument Mike makes," she told Axios.
- "Mike does not have constitutional authority to overrule the courts. Ignoring those rulings is tyranny Trump's own White House lawyers testified against him. Trump's campaign lawyers testified against him. Trump's Justice Department officials testified against him. So did his VP," she added.
- "If Trump is somehow elected, neither Mike nor anyone else will be able to control him."
